Joining us now ben rhodes and an msnbc political analyst.

then the president  obama's saying look this coronavirus would have been bad in the United States it was going to hit the  hard the numbers were going to be defficult to bear and by the way that means you know 20,000 dead maybe or some numbers smaller than current number
but difficult .

but with this trump administration. Barack Obama sees it as chaos.  I think we have a right to believe that those words got to Donald Trump.  

coronavirus pandemic/ ben rhodes ,Fmr,obama deputy National security adviser.

yeah they,absolutely did because everything that Barack Obama dose seems to trigger .

Dom Trump all the way back to when Donald Trump built his political brand saying that barack obama wasn't born in the United States i think what  bothers President President .

Obama so much is frankly as he used to tell us that he saw the presidency as running a relay this you run your leg and then you hand off the baton to the guy after you or the woman after you and the rely race that he ran when it came to these types of diseases is you know we had a bull outbreak that really rattled us in 2014 it took 

the lives of two people here in the United States after that  President Obama set uo a pandemic preparedness office in the White House that President Trump shut down he set up a playbook Iiterally that was handed to the Trump administration how do you respond to a pandemic they toss in the garbage he set up a cabinet level exercise in the transition the incoming Trump team and they clearly ignored that and frankly they end up getting rid of most of people who were in that exercise given the turnover and set up a global infrastructure of people to monitor for pandemics including smoebody who is in China and worked sith that lad Wuhan and Trump downsized that program by 75% including getting rid of that person who could have been our eyes and 
ears in  China and so what I think is so frustrating is that your leg of the relay race and you try to set it up for the next person  and they come along and they ignore all that and that has real-life consequences like and death consequences depression level economic consequence.

MC: there's also an  implication her for the campaign because in some of the leaked material President Obama was saying how vigorously he hopes to campaign for Joe Biden l'm not sure how they do that if they can't be on a campaign trail but you know online womehow and it seems that if President Obama is such a trigger for Donald Turmp that every time 

he does any kind of campaign appearance for Joe Biden there's gonna be an explosive reaction from Donald Trump.

** you know call i can tell you Lawrence had talked to the former president he's going to be campaigning however he can whether that's in person or whether that's online whatever medium  

he can he's going to take this message out to the American people in a way that i think the American people haven't heard from in in a while and and if you heard his endorsement video of Joe Biden the made a very comprehensive and forceful case not just against

Donald Trump but for Joe Biden and I think Donald Trump you know it's interesting Lawrence said I thind presidents ded used to not having people kind of at their level taking shots  at them or pointing out what they've done wrong we know that  this President Donald Trump surrounds himself with people who tell him how gradients he has press conferences where he asks people to praise him he's gonna be in for a situation where he's got Barack Obama and Joe Biden and a lot of people making the very easy case against what Donald Trump is done given where we find ourselves in the case for Joe Biden